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Post by bolverk on Aug 18, 2008 11:16:04 GMT -5
Well, the unilateral war is one of the issues. Remember, when it started, we had a Republican majority in Congress, with very few Dems willing to speak up.....the fear factor was in high speed motion. While some may think there are people who are having an 8- year "tantrum", I suppose you can relate to your own when Clinton was in office........ Regardless, the pres. and his admin. are subject to the same laws as Congress under the Constitution. You mean you need to see that list of prominent, high level Democrats that not only voted for both wars, but stumped for them as well? Only Congress can declare war, so if anyone is at fault for us being there, it is Congress, not the President. But, that is a bit to simple for you to comprehend isn't it. Of the 18 paragraphs in Section - 8 The Powers of Congress, this one is the one that squarely places the responsibility of Iraq on the shoulders of Congress: To declare War, grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal, and make Rules concerning Captures on Land and Water; |
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Post by bolverk on Aug 18, 2008 11:33:14 GMT -5
Well, the unilateral war is one of the issues. Remember, when it started, we had a Republican majority in Congress, with very few Dems willing to speak up.....the fear factor was in high speed motion. While some may think there are people who are having an 8- year "tantrum", I suppose you can relate to your own when Clinton was in office........ Regardless, the pres. and his admin. are subject to the same laws as Congress under the Constitution. Really? I am afraid that is not the case. Congress is regulated by 10 sections of the Constitution, with a total of 52 paragraphs. None of which apply to the President. The President, or Executive Branch, is governed by four sections, and a total of 12 paragraphs, one of which is Section 4 - DisqualificationThe President, Vice President and all civil Officers of the United States, shall be removed from Office on Impeachment for, and Conviction of, Treason, Bribery, or other high Crimes and Misdemeanors. There are, of course, some Articles of Amendments that deal with the Executive Branch. However, these do not limit his power, they control Term Limits, Disability and Succession and Choosing the President and Vice President. Congress is by far vested with more power. But, the blame game coming from congress is what got us the "New Majority." And, as the last two years have shown, they really don't have our best interests at heart, now do they. That is why they run out for a vacation rather then bringing a crucial energy bill up for a vote, which would allow Republicans to offer amendments. But, they want Obama elected, so they bottle it up because their position is the polar opposite of the wants and needs of the people. That is the type of Congress we have. A Democrat Congress no less. |
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Post by The Big Dog on Aug 18, 2008 15:44:16 GMT -5
Apparently some of the Democrat Caucus in the House have convinced Madame Speaker that she is flushing seats away in the election if she doesn't at least allow the current bill to come to the floor for a vote. Like Senator Kennedy way back when, she appears to have changed her position on off shore drilling. Pelosi willing to consider more drilling |
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Post by The Big Dog on Aug 18, 2008 15:47:36 GMT -5
That is why they run out for a vacation rather then bringing a crucial energy bill up for a vote, which would allow Republicans to offer amendments. But, they want Obama elected, so they bottle it up because their position is the polar opposite of the wants and needs of the people. That is the type of Congress we have. A Democrat Congress no less. In fairness, it should be pointed out that the August through mid-September recess is traditional going back to the earliest days of the seat of government being located in D.C. Back before there was air conditioning. If you've ever been in D.C. this time of year, you know what I'm talking about. That tradition, however, should have had absolutely no bearing on bringing the bill to a floor vote, up or down, prior to the recess taking place. That it did not happen is due to one person alone, and that person's name is Pelosi. |
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Post by Mink on Aug 19, 2008 23:03:07 GMT -5
So, does this mean that you admit bush/admin has no clue of the Constitution as well, which is why she should have pursued impeachment? And don't start with the "Bush lied" garbage. He may have cherry picked the intellegence, but Congress, including the members now yelling for his head, were saying the same things in the 90s. So were many heads of state and their intellegence agencies. We aren't in the 90's. He lied to the country by his cherry picking intelligence, going to war needlessly, not only allowing an undercover CIA agent's identity to be exposed, but commuting the sentence of the scapegoat.........we can go on and on and on..........and you guys are only looking at Madame Speaker. |
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Post by bolverk on Aug 21, 2008 14:57:07 GMT -5
And don't start with the "Bush lied" garbage. He may have cherry picked the intellegence, but Congress, including the members now yelling for his head, were saying the same things in the 90s. So were many heads of state and their intellegence agencies. We aren't in the 90's. He lied to the country by his cherry picking intelligence, going to war needlessly, not only allowing an undercover CIA agent's identity to be exposed, but commuting the sentence of the scapegoat.........we can go on and on and on..........and you guys are only looking at Madame Speaker. Let me take a page out of your book. Those are ancient history. Madame Speaker is now, and our energy crisis is on us. The Iraq war is over and negotiations to bring the troops home are nearly completed. Focus on the topic at hand. Don't hijack the thread. Etc., etc., etc. |
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Post by mrroqout on Aug 21, 2008 17:55:00 GMT -5
We aren't in the 90's. He lied to the country by his cherry picking intelligence, going to war needlessly, not only allowing an undercover CIA agent's identity to be exposed, but commuting the sentence of the scapegoat.........we can go on and on and on..........and you guys are only looking at Madame Speaker. Let me take a page out of your book. Those are ancient history. Madame Speaker is now, and our energy crisis is on us. The Iraq war is over and negotiations to bring the troops home are nearly completed. Focus on the topic at hand. Don't hijack the thread. Etc., etc., etc. Otherwise I will roll out the Billy Clinton Laundry list...... And I KNOW they don't like that.....matter at hand yatayatayata |
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Post by Mink on Aug 21, 2008 22:39:12 GMT -5
Who is hijacking? I'm merely suggesting that while mud is being slung (and it is legitimate) .....let us take a look at the whole picture. BTW, since when is the Iraq war over bloverk? Hahahaaa... months ago, no one in the bush admin. would even think about that scenario.....hahaaaa, now it is over? " Do as they say, but not as they do.....and do it now!" "When we say it ( war) begins, it begins, and we must fear the enemy, so go shopping......now, it is over and BTW, good luck!"  "Now, fo after Madame Speaker go we can get the majority back and do more damage....." hahahaaaaaaa |
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Len
Apprentice Member
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Post by Len on Aug 22, 2008 6:36:35 GMT -5
Don't like agree with you, Mink, but you may be right. The war in Japan is over; in Germany it's over; in Italy, well who cares? Point being those are sovereign nations and this ain't that kind of "war". Heck, our "leaders" didn't have what it takes to follow Article 1, Section 8, but differed so Bush could get the credit, er blame!
This isn't even like Korea. But like all those other countries, as long as we are in Iraq, and I mean one soldier, there will be guys pot shooting at him. These guys have been at war longer than history has been written and that is the place where it was first started. What we did was The Most Noble thing, and none in history has ever tried it, but it ain't over until we are out. We started a government, a military, assisted in forming a police force, build schools, hospitals, allowed businesses to commence, and I can't think of another nation that has done such. But it ain't over, at least until we're out totally. And like Japan, Germany, Korea, etc, we ain't leaving, and they're not even shooting at US there!
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Post by bolverk on Aug 22, 2008 10:53:33 GMT -5
Who is hijacking? I'm merely suggesting that while mud is being slung (and it is legitimate) .....let us take a look at the whole picture. BTW, since when is the Iraq war over bloverk? Hahahaaa... months ago, no one in the bush admin. would even think about that scenario.....hahaaaa, now it is over? " Do as they say, but not as they do.....and do it now!" "When we say it ( war) begins, it begins, and we must fear the enemy, so go shopping......now, it is over and BTW, good luck!" "Now, fo after Madame Speaker go we can get the majority back and do more damage....." hahahaaaaaaa The actual war was over with the capture of Saddam Hussein. Everything else was just clean up. |
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Post by bolverk on Aug 22, 2008 10:57:15 GMT -5
Who is hijacking? I'm merely suggesting that while mud is being slung (and it is legitimate) .....let us take a look at the whole picture. BTW, since when is the Iraq war over bloverk? Hahahaaa... months ago, no one in the bush admin. would even think about that scenario.....hahaaaa, now it is over? " Do as they say, but not as they do.....and do it now!" "When we say it ( war) begins, it begins, and we must fear the enemy, so go shopping......now, it is over and BTW, good luck!" "Now, fo after Madame Speaker go we can get the majority back and do more damage....." hahahaaaaaaa And, by the way, the title of thread is Madame Speaker's real agenda? Not, George W. Bush's Iraq war. The real agenda of our great Madame Speaker? To get Obama elected, nothing else. Which is exactly why they did not bring the energy bill to a vote, to prevent Republicans from adding amendments that would bring the Democrat position into question. Politics before the people, the true agenda of Nancy Pelosi. |
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Post by saunterelle on Aug 22, 2008 12:51:44 GMT -5
Who is hijacking? I'm merely suggesting that while mud is being slung (and it is legitimate) .....let us take a look at the whole picture. BTW, since when is the Iraq war over bloverk? Hahahaaa... months ago, no one in the bush admin. would even think about that scenario.....hahaaaa, now it is over? " Do as they say, but not as they do.....and do it now!" "When we say it ( war) begins, it begins, and we must fear the enemy, so go shopping......now, it is over and BTW, good luck!" "Now, fo after Madame Speaker go we can get the majority back and do more damage....." hahahaaaaaaa The actual war was over with the capture of Saddam Hussein. Everything else was just clean up. And what was that about insurgents? I thought the tagline was: "We're fighting them over there so we don't have to fight them here." |
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"Now, fo after Madame Speaker go we can get the majority back and do more damage....." hahahaaaaaaa