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Post by JustMyOpinion on Nov 19, 2008 9:41:35 GMT -5
To add:
For the most part Lexus repairs are not anymore expensive than Toyota since Toyota parts are used and many good repair shops can work on them for a lot less than say the BMW. Another bonus...
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Post by saunterelle on Nov 19, 2008 12:09:39 GMT -5
Saunterelle, how are you coming on that CNG Honda Civic I have repeatedly pointed you to? Isn't it time for you to walk the walk? Why do you keep going back to this point rather than comment on why the US automakers are failing? I've said that I will consider a CNG Honda when I need a new car if the infrastructure for refueling and maintainable is in place. Tesla Motors (funded by Google) is also working on an electric car that doesn't cost an arm and a leg. |
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Post by bolverk on Nov 19, 2008 12:43:26 GMT -5
No bolverk, you are the fool. I admitted that unions were a part of the problem but they are not the only thing sinking the automakers. You failed to address the other parts of the problem. Perhaps this is because you're a stubborn partisan hack. A large part of the automaker's problem is that they've put all their eggs in the SUV basket instead of giving Americans the cars they want: Reliable, safe vehicles that get great gas mileage. You cry that it's the union's fault without examining the root cause of the problem. How foolish of you. I am a fool. Based on what I have seen in the local automobile sales business. I have lived here since 1963 and I have known this particular individual since I was in 5th grade. For 36 years I have had an inside connection to what is going on in that particular industry. You do not have a clue what you are talking about. Our automobile industry has been in decline since the 1980's, when Chrysler was bailed out. Chrysler went on to offer some the best cars ever created in modern times. But, the American public wanted Japanese cars because they were less expensive at the time. Less expensive because they did not have unions in Japan. Were you aware that during that period warranty repairs were about equal on imported and domestic automobiles? The difference, warranty repairs on American made cars were related to cosmetic issues which required little time to fix. Warranty repairs on Japanese cars at the time were usually for something major with the engine or transmission. Now, you have unions so powerful in the Auto Industry, that they want a $25 billion bailout just for the unions, in addition to the $25 billion dollar bailout for the Auto Industry. That just doubled the cost of the bailout, didn't it. Just like unions now do to the cost of cars. |
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Post by bolverk on Nov 19, 2008 12:54:04 GMT -5
Americans don't build a quality car? And some of you base that on buying only one brand, GM.
I am currently driving a car I bought brand new ten years ago. It is the most copied style of vehicle out there. It is called a Chrysler minivan. It has a four cylinder engine that gets awesome gas mileage. NO OTHER CAR COMPANY MADE THIS TYPE OF VEHICLE UNTIL CHRYSLER CREATED IT.
The reason none of you believe in the American Car manufacturers any longer is because you do not drive their cars, ever. Chrysler makes some sweet rides. It created the best four cylinder engine on the market in the late 1980's. But did any of you try them? I doubt it. Those who did were impressed.
The trouble with our Automobile Industry is the same problem we are having elsewhere. Overpaid, under performing executives. When Lido Anthony Iacocca left Chrysler, it was all down hill from there. There is not a single executive that can hold a candle to this man working in the industry today. They should suffer with no bailout because of it.
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Post by bolverk on Nov 19, 2008 12:58:30 GMT -5
There ain't no free lunches in this country. And don't go spending your whole life commiserating that you got raw deals. You've got to say, 'I think that if I keep working at this and want it bad enough I can have it.'
Lee Iacocca
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Post by maxsawdust on Nov 19, 2008 13:44:30 GMT -5
How about a study from our government: eetd.lbl.gov/EAP/teepa/pdf/Are_SUVs_Safer.pdf Here's an excerpt: "The risk to drivers of average midsize and large cars is about the same as for the average
SUV. The risks differ in their makeup, with a higher fraction
of fatalities in SUVs from rollovers. Similarly, the risk to drivers
of the safest midsize and large car models (Avalon, Camry, and
Accord) is about the same as for the safest SUVs (Suburban,
Cherokee, and Tahoe). However, the average SUV poses nearly
twice the risk to drivers of other vehicles as do the average
midsize and large cars. The net result is that the combined risk
of the average SUV (129) is about 25 to 30 percent higher than
that of the average midsize (105) or large car (100)."Saunterelle you are Soooooooooooo transparent and duplicitous... AGAIN TODAY - The "Government" is infallible... When EVERY OTHER DAY to you they are the "Gub'ment" and too stupid to do ANYTHING properly.. You cannot have it both ways...although I am sure you like that. |
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Post by saunterelle on Nov 19, 2008 13:51:32 GMT -5
How about a study from our government: eetd.lbl.gov/EAP/teepa/pdf/Are_SUVs_Safer.pdf Here's an excerpt: "The risk to drivers of average midsize and large cars is about the same as for the average
SUV. The risks differ in their makeup, with a higher fraction
of fatalities in SUVs from rollovers. Similarly, the risk to drivers
of the safest midsize and large car models (Avalon, Camry, and
Accord) is about the same as for the safest SUVs (Suburban,
Cherokee, and Tahoe). However, the average SUV poses nearly
twice the risk to drivers of other vehicles as do the average
midsize and large cars. The net result is that the combined risk
of the average SUV (129) is about 25 to 30 percent higher than
that of the average midsize (105) or large car (100)."Saunterelle you are Soooooooooooo transparent and duplicitous... AGAIN TODAY - The "Government" is infallible... When EVERY OTHER DAY to you they are the "Gub'ment" and too stupid to do ANYTHING properly.. You cannot have it both ways...although I am sure you like that. Anything you disagree with you deny and discredit. Even your own government. What a tool! |
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Post by saunterelle on Nov 19, 2008 13:54:32 GMT -5
Americans don't build a quality car? And some of you base that on buying only one brand, GM. I am currently driving a car I bought brand new ten years ago. It is the most copied style of vehicle out there. It is called a Chrysler minivan. It has a four cylinder engine that gets awesome gas mileage. NO OTHER CAR COMPANY MADE THIS TYPE OF VEHICLE UNTIL CHRYSLER CREATED IT. The reason none of you believe in the American Car manufacturers any longer is because you do not drive their cars, ever. Chrysler makes some sweet rides. It created the best four cylinder engine on the market in the late 1980's. But did any of you try them? I doubt it. Those who did were impressed. The trouble with our Automobile Industry is the same problem we are having elsewhere. Overpaid, under performing executives. When Lido Anthony Iacocca left Chrysler, it was all down hill from there. There is not a single executive that can hold a candle to this man working in the industry today. They should suffer with no bailout because of it. I've already admitted that Unions are part of the problem but you seem too stubborn to admit that the quality of American-made automobiles have been dismal. If you don't believe me, look at any objective auto research company, namely Consumer Reports. Or are they just another example of "gotcha" media who's schilling for the Left. LOL. |
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Post by bolverk on Nov 19, 2008 14:30:54 GMT -5
No, you did not admit it, you have said that you have admitted it, but in this thread any admission you made was not a direct admission. I have read the whole thing.
As far as upgrading plants, you still have not answered that question. Because our auto plants have been retooled many, many times, which is an upgrade. But, you won't admit that, will you.
Lastly, again mismanagement is a part of this problem as well. But so is the fact that Japan does not have to add the cost of Unions to their products built overseas, now do they. Even when you calculate in shipping costs their cost remain lower then locally produced products.
The unions put themselves onto the path of closing down the automakers in the late 70's and early 80's and nothing is going to stop it, short of firing everyone and going non-union. When automakers employees started earning higher then the national wage for the type of work they were doing, getting sweet benefits and adding higher costs to the products so they could no longer compete, that spelled the end of the auto industry in this country. They have been in their death throws for three decades.
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Post by The Big Dog on Nov 19, 2008 14:33:35 GMT -5
None of which, saunterelle, has anything to do with the overwhelming burden of union benefits that the Big Three are struggling with, which is at the root of their current financial woes.
Were you aware that GM is forced to pay 80% salary to idled workers doing nothing? That's something between 8 and 10 thousand furloughed employees right at the moment. The cash for the bailout is to fund pension and union mandates, in large part, not to make or keep the Big Three competetive or raise their quality.
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Post by saunterelle on Nov 19, 2008 14:58:31 GMT -5
Yes, that's a large part of the problem, I don't agree with bailing them out.
Unions, mismanagement, and poor quality cars are the three factors that are bringing down US Auto.
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Post by maxsawdust on Nov 19, 2008 15:12:01 GMT -5
Saunterelle you are Soooooooooooo transparent and duplicitous... AGAIN TODAY - The "Government" is infallible... When EVERY OTHER DAY to you they are the "Gub'ment" and too stupid to do ANYTHING properly.. You cannot have it both ways...although I am sure you like that. Anything you disagree with you deny and discredit. Even your own government. What a tool! Hi pot meet kettle. Well first clownshow, I DID NOT attempt to DENY nor DisCredit...I leave that to you.. I merely stated how funny it is that NOW you hold the Government to be the UTMOST authority....WHEN IT SUITS YOUR retarded liberal cause..Otherwise they are the dumbest people on earth... Again although we know you like to have it both ways you cannot have it both ways. Me the tool Bwaaahahahahahahaaa |
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