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Post by subdjoe on Jun 3, 2008 17:49:43 GMT -5
Again, redirecting from another thread to keep some from accusing me of being 'off topic' even though adult conversations will range all over the place. This is a response to Bolverks post of 12;26 on 3 June.
"The Second Day of July 1776, will be the most memorable Epocha, in the History of America. I am apt to believe that it will be celebrated, by succeeding Generations, as the great anniversary Festival. It ought to be commemorated, as the Day of Deliverance by solemn Acts of Devotion to God Almighty. It ought to be solemnized with Pomp and Parade, with Shews, Games, Sports, Guns, Bells, Bonfires and Illuminations from one End of this Continent to the other from this Time forward forever more.'
Kind of funny how the fascist liberals will quote ad nauseum the line from Jeffersons letter about the 'wall of separation' and give that comment force of law, but will ignore something like this - one of the founders and framers advocating that the citizens practice "solemn Acts of Devotion to God Almighty" and then "It ought to be solemnized with Pomp and Parade, with Shews, Games, Sports, Guns, Bells, Bonfires and Illuminations " telling us to celebrate with shooting sports and fireworks. Kind of shoot a hole in their collectivist view of the RKBA, not to mention the use argument that they always try to advance. Adams clearly thought that people had fire arms for sport as well as protection or hunting. Why don't these comments by Adams carry the same weight with them as Jeffersons comments? Let's try to be consistant.
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Post by The Big Dog on Jun 4, 2008 1:13:37 GMT -5
Adams's comments do not carry the same weight because it would not be politically correct for them to do so. Simple as that.
Hopefully the Heller decision will change a little of the jurisprudence around that question, even though it won't change much thinking I am afraid.
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Post by bolverk on Jun 4, 2008 13:12:36 GMT -5
Democrats are no longer true patriots, nor are the people who seek to limit our freedoms. Just like Ronald Reagan said, "There's a clear cause and effect here that is as neat and predictable as a law of physics: As government expands, liberty contracts."
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Post by saunterelle on Jun 4, 2008 13:24:42 GMT -5
Democrats are true patriots and will bring integrity back to the White House in November. Fact: Bush's Patriot Act limited our freedoms. By your definition this would make him un-patriotic. Fact: Bush expanded government and government spending. See article: www.economist.com/world/na/displaystory.cfm?story_id=2335473 So, going by your quote, they Republicans are giving up our liberty. Time to kick them out of office once and for all!
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Post by bolverk on Jun 4, 2008 13:35:17 GMT -5
Did I say Bush was patriotic?
This is not a discussion about the election, it is a discussion about our founding fathers and their ideas about freedom and liberty. Every law your side of the isle advances about guns, fireworks, speech, religion and many other issues are contradictory to those ideas. They believed in individual rights, your party does not. Your party advances group rights, not individual rights.
At every opportunity, and in every way possible, your party seeks to expand government. And by caveat, you reduce our liberties.
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