Oakland Working Hard to Maintain its Status

[subdjoe]

Where have I tried to justify it? Give me a quote. What I AM trying to do is show that it wasn't the way it gets taught in junior high. And that junior high level is held through at least the 100 series classes in college. Sometimes even into the 300 lever, depending on the class. Whites, on their own, showed up on african shores, kidnapped blacks, etc. The exact thing you have been spouting here.

[saunterelle]

"Yes, there are some horror stories, but there are as many who thougth of those as good days, and were part of the family of their owners."

Well, I guess that if slavery is all you've ever known, your owners would become your family. You see the same phenomena in abused children and abused spouses. Very sad, really, and no excuse.

Please explain why that should affect the feelings of modern-day African Americans. Should they suddenly feel okay because their ancestors felt "like part of the family" in their slave homes? The fact is that slavery is a huge blight on America's past, and it has left modern-day African Americans feeling like they don't have roots.

[The Big Dog]

Saunterelle, once again, insists that formal education trumps all and is superior to all. He holds himself better than all of us because he learned in a classroom. By the way he plays it, you'd think he had a whole wall full of degrees.... more maybe than a thermometer.

But while all that learning may have conferred some modicum of respect in the form of parchments on your wall, it didn't teach you common sense. And no amount of classroom learning ever can. I learned a lot in a classroom... got the degree to prove it. And I learned a helll of a lot more on the street living my life. Maybe more than you ever wilk learn in any hundred classrooms, Saunterelle.

Having said that I have to say that, today Oakland worked very hard to elevate itself. I watched a good portion of the funeral service on local TV and/or on line. 15000 plus LEOs attended today's service. There were so many cops and firefighters that they had to put the overflow into the Oakland Coliseum next door. I have never, in my life, seen so many motor units... and I've been to more than a few LEO funerals.

AMTRAK offered a free pass coming and going to every current and past LEO who was attending to show support and to try to keep the # of cars to a more manageable level on the freeways so as to not impact the community at large as much. The Governor spoke, as did the Attorney General and Senator Feinstein. Mayor Dellums was there, but was asked specifically by one of the families to not say a word....... which should tell you something right there. Do you get it Saunterelle?

New York and Boston PD were in attendance. Las Vegas Metro PD, along with most of Nevada, sent guys and pretty much every agency in California was represented. SFPD, one of my stomps, sent over 500... better than a quarter of the department. The RCMP sent a contingent, and there were some other foreign LEOs in attendance as well.

The entire Oakland Police Department, all 950 of them including the SWAT sergeant who was wounded in the shootout, attended, as did pretty much the entire support staff. Calls for police service in Oakland were handled by a mix of Alameda County SO, Berkeley PD, San Leandro PD and East Bay Regional Parks PD. Firefighters manned overpasses along the funeral routes in salute and many of the good citizens of Oakland, as opposed to the bad ones, could be seen manning the rails on the overpasses to show their respect to four men who gave everything they were and all they were ever going to be to the city.

I have never in my life seen anything like it, and I hope to God I never do again.

Counterpoint that, with this. Yesterday some 60 or so people stood up in East Oaklandf to protest in solidarity for that cowardly parolee piece of shit Lovelle Mixon, waving the race card and talking smack. Sure, they were within their First Amendment right to do so, no matter how wrong or even evil they might have been in their intent. They were entitled to be heard... all 60 of them.

But what the city did today, with 15,000 LEOs present, celebrating the lives and accomplishments of the four fallen officers and sending a clear message to all that the city will go on and that the law will stand up to the forces of evil, makes those asshole protestors shit look kind of weak.... doesn't it?

That is the here and now. It is the reality of the situation on the ground in Oakland. As much as the guilty white liberals and the race baiters among the black community would like it to be, it ain't about slavery. The entire issue of slavery as a cause for what is going on today is an utter canard. It is a rhetorical crutch on which ignorant, self loathing white liberals and opportunistic race baiting blacks can both get something. The whites get their consciences massaged, the race baiting blacks get rich and powerful.... like Jesse Jackson, for instance.

Now, in the aftermath, Oakland reaches a crossroad. Does it continue to saddle itself with race baiters, crooks and guilty white liberals, or does it continue to move toward the light that was shone so brightly today?

[subdjoe]

The narratives were taken in the '30s. So the former slaves had had a long life to compare it with. So, bang goes one of you assumptions.

Slavery is a blight on EVERY culture. And, the african slave trade still goes on as it has since lord knows when. It was, and IS not a uniquely American thing.

Feel like they have no roots? That is the fault of the culture of victimhood, and I would guess applies mostly to the blacks in the northern cities. There are plenty of blacks who embrace their heretage, both free and slave. Those who dare to take pride that their black ancestors in N. America were free, or had bought themselves free, or were slave owners, or fought for the Confederacy are roundly denounced as trators or deluded idiots.

So, how about addressing my question - what would you say to a black who is proud of his ancestors who fought for freedom in the Confederacy? What would you say to a white whose ancestors had been white slaves?

[saunterelle]

Big Dog, my comments were not meant to excuse Mixon's actions in any way. It was a despicable act and those who were protesting are obviously confused and undereducated. The city of Oakland has had this problem on its hands for a long time and it is only getting worse. It was a moving service today, I listened to part of it on the radio.

Subdjoe, I would respect their right to feel that way but I think that people in their circumstance are few and far between.

[The New Guy]

i encourage you, santurelle to join these folks in their next protest. bring your school learnin' certificate with you. i'm sure they'll be impressed.

[Mink]

subdjoe wrote:

"Slavery is a blight on EVERY culture."

I hope you are prepared to back up this statement.

"And, the african slave trade still goes on as it has since lord knows when. It was, and IS not a uniquely American thing"

Does the slave trade make it right? If some slave owners treated their slaves like ''family, if you treat your family like slaves", why is that acceptable to you?

[subdjoe]

I knew you and saunterellle woudn't understand. I am NOT --- N - O - T--- supporitng slavery. I AM trying to show that the view of slavery as taught in schools, and pushed by the left is NOT an accurate picture. Nor is the view of race relations in the south before and during the Civil war. But, you won't do any research, I doubt that you have checked any of the links that have been posted over and over here about slaver and race relations.

AS for proof - name a culture that has not engaged in slavery in some form at some point in its history. We know that it was, and is practiced in Africa. And was in Japan. And China. And Korea. And Russia. And western Europe. And by Native Americans, north and south America. India had it. The Turks sure as hell had it. Even aboriginal Austrialians had it.

So, what culture are you thinking of that didn't have slavery?

[subdjoe]

Oh, by the way, I have met three blacks who reenact as Confederates because their FREE BLACK ancestors fought for the Confederacy. I have yet to meet a black Federal reenactor who had an ancestor in the segregated regiments. How many have you met, Saunterelle?

Oh, wait. They just did research on their family roots (something you deny they have) and found out about GGGG Grand dad. Their story wasn't in a book about 'the black experience.'
And you will NEVER find stories like that in books about 'the black experience' because they don't fit the party line of all blacks are victims all the time.

[Mink]

Mar 28, 2009 2:04:09 GMT -5 subdjoe said:

I knew you and saunterellle woudn't understand. I am NOT --- N - O - T--- supporitng slavery. I AM trying to show that the view of slavery as taught in schools, and pushed by the left is NOT an accurate picture. Nor is the view of race relations in the south before and during the Civil war. But, you won't do any research, I doubt that you have checked any of the links that have been posted over and over here about slaver and race relations.

AS for proof - name a culture that has not engaged in slavery in some form at some point in its history. We know that it was, and is practiced in Africa. And was in Japan. And China. And Korea. And Russia. And western Europe. And by Native Americans, north and south America. India had it. The Turks sure as hell had it. Even aboriginal Austrialians had it.

So, what culture are you thinking of that didn't have slavery?

What you are doing and saying is that slavery was the "Left's" agenda and this is simply not true, which is why I say we are in two different eras regarding Blacks. I say slavery was brought to this country, whether stolen or captured (same difference) and we, the United States bought into it and are just as guilty.

If the "Left" is pushing it, what does that make conservatives? Are they not willing or strong enough to fight for the truth and incorporate it in schools?

As for your statement of slavery being a part of every culture, I suppose that that be traced back in time. Why would you only go back so many years for slavery in the US, but go further in time to justify slavery in every culture? Could you supply a link to prove your claim?

[subdjoe]

[quote author=mink board=localissues thread=1174 post=14205 time=1238272067What you are doing and saying is that slavery was the "Left's" agenda and this is simply not true, which is why I say we are in two different eras regarding Blacks. I say slavery was brought to this country, whether stolen or captured (same difference) and we, the United States bought into it and are just as guilty.

If the "Left" is pushing it, what does that make conservatives? Are they not willing or strong enough to fight for the truth and incorporate it in schools?

As for your statement of slavery being a part of every culture, I suppose that that be traced back in time. Why would you only go back so many years for slavery in the US, but go further in time to justify slavery in every culture? Could you supply a link to prove your claim?
[/quote]

OK, Mink, I am sick and tired of your LIES. Yes, Big Fat F****g LIES about what I am saying. Same for Saunterelle.
I am NOT - you do understand that word, dont you? N O T - NOTNOTNOT - in any way shape or form trying to justify chattal slavery. Period. No matter how many times you or saunterelle LIE about it, or try to twist my words, I have not ever attemped to justifiy it (note, unless in a debate and I was assigned to play devils advocate). So you and Saunterelle can take that lie and shove it.

As for "Why would you only go back so many years for slavery in the US" CHRIST ON A POGO STICK!!!!! That is one of the DUMBEST things you have ever posted here. How about because we don't go back all that far here? I'm not going to do like you and other leftists do and just make things up. The first european settelers here didn't buy the first slave until the early 1600s. I can't go back farther than that. I'm sure your heros - Gore, Moore, DiFi, Woolsey, and Boxer could.

I guess since for the past 8 years you have bought into and as a willing tool spread the lies of the DNC and its minioins, it has become easy for you to put LIES into the mouths (or posts) of others. I guess I shouldn't be surprised when you do it here.

[The Avenger]

It seems that the real issue in this thread is that Ms. Mink and Ms. Santurelle believe the piece of pond scum who killed 4 police officers is less guilty because his ancestors might have been slaves.

It is typicall of mentally challenged liberals to look for an excuse in every violent crime. Even if someone is caught on video, has 100 witnesses to the crime, and professes his own guilt liberals will still want to know if he was touched by an uncle when he was young.