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Post by jgaffney on Jun 12, 2009 22:31:46 GMT -5
It is my understanding that a natural gas automobile is not currently a viable alternative.
Liquified Natural Gas (LNG) conversions for existing cars have been around for quite a while. In fact, Honda sells a version of the Civic already set up to run on LNG. The problem with the LNG automobile is the refueling. Currently, the only place you can refuel an LNG car is at the PG&E yard on Occidental Road in Santa Rosa. Various manufacturers have tried to bring out a home refueling station, connected to your house gas lateral (it's the same gas), but ran into safety, pricing and billing issues. |
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Post by capttankona on Jun 15, 2009 11:41:43 GMT -5
jgff, how about mileage?
It is my understanding that these vehicles do not get near the mileage per gallon that a petroleum based engine does. Though it is difficult to find an actual rating, it is listed as one of the disadvantages of a LNG or CNG vehicle.
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Post by capttankona on Jul 21, 2009 11:49:01 GMT -5
Well, it seems there are some cracks forming in this "deal" struck by Obama and the auto companies that went into bankruptcy. The cracks are being caused by "government" as congress attempts to circumvent the closings of some 3,000 dealerships. Here is one story.Oh yeah, so much for the guarantee of warranties by the Government. I guess these companies will now handle them. One would hope. Here is the other story.And what is with this Ron Bloom character? Why the hell did Steve Rattner step down to return to private life in New York in less then six months? |
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mrbose
Senior Member
Posts: 898
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Post by mrbose on Jul 21, 2009 12:09:40 GMT -5
Make Arnold the new auto Czar
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Post by capttankona on Jul 22, 2009 15:46:03 GMT -5
Now the socialist or statist aspect of the auto industry bailout are starting to show. Closed Chrysler dealerships are being scrutinized by Congress in a bid to keep them open, beyond the Bankruptcy plan. Chrysler has said that if they must service these dealers it will likely destroy the deal with Fiat and push the company into insolvency, forcing them to terminate operations and close the company, selling off all assets in the process.
Hows that for "Democracy" saunterelle?
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Post by JustMyOpinion on Jul 23, 2009 10:55:51 GMT -5
It seems obvious to me that the UAW ruined the American car industry. The workers were over paid for less, and got paid even when factories closed. The consequence? The car companies started using inferior parts for the interiors etc. and we were supposed to continue to pay top dollar to offset the auto workers wages anyway? Less quality, pay more mentalilty is futile.
I am not unpatriotic, but I'm not a fool either. The last American made car I'd purchased was at least 20 years ago if not longer. If you think about it when's the last time any of you purchased anything made in the USA? And, how much did you have to pay for it, and was it worth it? I don't mind paying a little extra for something if the quality is there, but...
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Post by subdjoe on Jul 23, 2009 12:10:09 GMT -5
It seems obvious to me that the UAW ruined the American car industry. The workers were over paid for less, and got paid even when factories closed. The consequence? The car companies started using inferior parts for the interiors etc. and we were supposed to continue to pay top dollar to offset the auto workers wages anyway? Less quality, pay more mentalilty is futile. I am not unpatriotic, but I'm not a fool either. The last American made car I'd purchased was at least 20 years ago if not longer. If you think about it when's the last time any of you purchased anything made in the USA? And, how much did you have to pay for it, and was it worth it? I don't mind paying a little extra for something if the quality is there, but... Funny - you blame the workers for taking the best contracts they can get - kind of a 'redistribution of wealth' on a small scale, yet you want the government to do the same thing on a national scale - give people the wealth of others without them having to work for it. At least the auto workers produced something. And no one held a gun to the heads of the Big Three and forced them to sign. People point to the Japanese auto industry as an example of enlightend big business. We have all seen the pictures of the clean, pleasant break rooms, the happy employees going though the moring briefing and group exercises. Yeah, great. What isn't shown is that the employees get there an hour or two before their shifts for those things, without pay. And often work overtime - without pay. Sometimes almost a double shift - with no extra pay. If they complain about it, or refuse to work without pay, they are out the door. And will likely not be able to find work for years. And rarely do you see the conditions that the parts jobbers work in - tiny, cramped buildings with no amenitites, barely room for the minimum wage workers to do their jobs. No benefits, no job security, nothing. Just monotonous, often back breaking labor, for slave wages. |
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Post by capttankona on Jul 23, 2009 12:10:34 GMT -5
Well, to be quite honest, the quality coming from most countries on most of the products we use in this country are not that good either. American manufacturing might is gone. Pissed away with high corporate taxes that force prices up for the consumer. Blame Government for that. And gee, which party is all about taxing the profits of the corporations we buy our products from?
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Post by saunterelle on Jul 23, 2009 12:33:36 GMT -5
JMO, I agree with you to an extent. The UAW costs add $2,000 to the price of a new car (about 10% of the price of most new cars). However, you would think that good old fashioned American ingenuity could overcome this hurdle and at least make the cars competitive with foreign competition. The fact is, the higher-ups in American car companies have been lazily resting on their laurels, producing high profit margin SUVs and thinking that would last forever. They must share some of the blame as well.
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Post by subdjoe on Jul 23, 2009 13:13:48 GMT -5
So, ella, you are saying that the auto workers should work out of the goodness of their hearts without pay? Or that they should work for minimum wage? Or maybe less than minimum wage?
I take it you turn down any raises you are offered to help keep costs down for your company.
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Post by saunterelle on Jul 23, 2009 13:19:35 GMT -5
Of course they should not work without pay, but they should make concessions in pay scale and retirement packages to a level that is more in line with what other US workers make. I do believe the union has bullied its way to achieve an unfair advantage. Bottom line is that the car companies should have been allowed to fail.
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Post by capttankona on Jul 23, 2009 14:33:55 GMT -5
Of course they should not work without pay, but they should make concessions in pay scale and retirement packages to a level that is more in line with what other US workers make. I do believe the union has bullied its way to achieve an unfair advantage. Bottom line is that the car companies should have been allowed to fail. Your funny. You sit here on this form, espousing socialism, statism and all sorts of isms that steal the freedom and liberty from people. Yet you embrace capitalism where the car companies are concerned? There may yet be hope for you. The simple fact about the unions is this. Your party put them in power. FDR gave them sweetheart deals in the early days. He gave them exemptions from anti-trust laws and various other laws were enacted to prevent companies from hiring new workers when these unions went on strike. FDR was so deep in the pockets of the unions that when those laws were passed, strikes did not abate, they grew to even greater numbers. Yep. FDR screwed this country royally when it came to unions. |
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