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Post by mrroqout on Jun 5, 2008 18:27:39 GMT -5
Yeah I LOOOVE Sources called "Opinon" and I am 1/2 British. But as such I KNOW FULL WELL they are an even worse lot than you and your type here in USA.
You would like nothing more than America to become the next Londonistan, which IS what London is these days. Thought crimes/hate crimes/cameras EVERYWHERE. I just love what England has become. Where Islamic Radicals have more free speech rights than the average UK Citizen. Can't wait to spend my August there..should be ...interesting.
Maybe your next reputable link can be to NPR?
And yes did AMERICAN ORDINANCE kill all these people, or did their own tribesman and countrymen do them in? Where are the numbers for that?
Do your sources count EVERY Civilian killed in Homicide Bombings/marketplace bombings etc?
And furthermore do you HONESTLY believe these bombings would DECREASE Markedly were we to cut and run?
LOL
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Post by saunterelle on Jun 5, 2008 18:38:17 GMT -5
"It was way, way past time to invade & occupy a middle eastern nation in 2003.
We never should have left in 1991-92, but when you go w/the UN, you leave w/the UN.
I am so glad we went to Iraq; soon we will go to Iran."
Is this why we went to war with Iraq? To invade and occupy a middle eastern nation?? That sure isn't how it was presented to the American people. You've just proved my point: That the Republicans lied to take us to war and they cannot be trusted with power. How about sending your son or daughter to fight in the middle east if you're so high on war and occupation!
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Post by harpman1 on Jun 5, 2008 19:00:03 GMT -5
Yes, it is why we went. I never cared if Sadaam had WMD's; he was one!
In a fight, it is best to eliminate the biggest, baddest, ugliest dude first; if only to "send a message" to his pals.
My child has served one combat tour & leaves again fall 2009, possibly w/BHO as CIC of the Army.
How about yours?
Ready to send your child to Darfur? Tibet? Myanmar?
We will be in that region for decades. Get used to it.
Nothing wrong w/Imperialism as long as the right nations & cultures are doing the work others would do if they had the strength to do it.
Let's imagine Canada; the U.S.; India; S Africa; Egypt; China etc. w/o British Imperialism.
Think they'd be anywhere near the 21st century w/o that experience?
Pacifism is usually merely cowardice masquerading as moral superiority.
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Post by mrroqout on Jun 5, 2008 19:02:16 GMT -5
I would GLADLY send my Daughter OR my Son to defend AMERICA when they are old enough to enlist.
Like my grandfather , my father my 3 brothers and myself.
It's called DUTY to ones country.
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Post by saunterelle on Jun 5, 2008 19:14:18 GMT -5
Wow. Well, I respect and admire your family's service to our country. However, I strongly disagree with your views on imperialism.
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Post by mrroqout on Jun 5, 2008 19:25:52 GMT -5
LOL Imperialism.
Nice touch.
I remember my twenties and college also...
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Post by harpman1 on Jun 5, 2008 19:35:20 GMT -5
The views on Imperialism are mine.
Agree or not, history shows that it worked.
Of course, we could always just talk them to death. Like B. Hussein Obamessiah.
I prefer a carrot(peace & democracy) & a stick(Carrier groups; 3rd Inf. Div.)
But that's just me.
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Post by The New Guy on Jun 5, 2008 20:06:30 GMT -5
Over 1 million Iraqis have been killed in Iraq due to Bush's blunderous war. 4091 American troops have been killed and more than 30,000 have been wounded since the war began in 2003. I ask you, how many more lives is it worth one of my favorite quotes certainly applies here: War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself. --John Stuart Mill |
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Post by The New Guy on Jun 5, 2008 20:09:25 GMT -5
the US has enjoyed the benefits of an ALL VOLUNTEER force since 1973. no one is sending their son or daughter to fight anywhere. all who join do so knowing full well what the possibilities are.
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Post by bolverk on Jun 6, 2008 11:19:01 GMT -5
Over 1 million Iraqis have been killed in Iraq due to Bush's blunderous war. That is a lie, plain and simple. 4091 American troops have been killed and more than 30,000 have been wounded since the war began in 2003. Yes, far less then in any war the United States has ever been in. That was like one day in the worst fighting of World War II. I ask you, how many more lives is it worth to you to rescue your party from the shame and disgrace of a failed war. The fact is we're in the quagmire that Cheney predicted in 1994. It's time to pull out now and bring our troops home safely. Actually, we are no longer in a quagmire, but it will become worse then ever if we leave, since insurgents will do to Iraq what they did to Lebanon. But, since you bury your head in the sand where reality is concerned, I would not expect you to understand that. Or maybe you are just trying to see more Iraqis die after we fought so hard to free them from the biggest despot since 1950. |
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Post by bolverk on Jun 6, 2008 11:22:48 GMT -5
Over 1 million Iraqis have been killed in Iraq due to Bush's blunderous war. 4091 American troops have been killed and more than 30,000 have been wounded since the war began in 2003. I ask you, how many more lives is it worth to you to rescue your party from the shame and disgrace of a failed war. The fact is we're in the quagmire that Cheney predicted in 1994. It's time to pull out now and bring our troops home safely. Your numbers are based on an opinion poll, that is all. Actual body counts are far lower. I quote: The Iraq Body Count (IBC) figure of 80,419 to 87,834 civilian deaths reported in English-language media (including Arabic media translated into English) up to 10 January 2008 includes civilian deaths due to coalition and insurgent military action, sectarian violence and increased criminal violence. The IBC site states: "it should be noted that many deaths will likely go unreported or unrecorded by officials and media."[12] For the 4th year of the war between 20 March 2006 and 16 March 2007 the Iraq Body Count reported approximately 26,540 civilian deaths. I quote th UN: The United Nations reported that 34,452 violent deaths occurred in 2006, based on data from morgues, hospitals, and municipal authorities across Iraq. I quote: Concerning war-related deaths (civilian and non-civilian), and deaths from criminal gangs, Iraq's Health Minister Ali al-Shemari said that since the March 2003 invasion between 100,000-150,000 Iraqis had been killed.[18] "Al-Shemari said on Thursday [Nov. 9, 2006] that he based his figure on an estimate of 100 bodies per day brought to morgues and hospitals – though such a calculation would come out closer to 130,000 in total." Even the Lancet Study, which includes deaths from increased lawlessness, degraded infrastructure, poorer healthcare, etc. only comes up with a figure of 654,965 deaths. The opinion survey you quote is based on unverifiable figures from a poll conducted in Iraq by a nationally representative sample of approximately 2000 Iraqi adults. Not scientific, and it counted not a single body. |
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Post by bolverk on Jun 6, 2008 11:30:55 GMT -5
Wow. Well, I respect and admire your family's service to our country. However, I strongly disagree with your views on imperialism. Liar. You show no respect to the military. |
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